Author Topic: What you hate about mages  (Read 50013 times)

Offline Maxou

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What you hate about mages
« Reply #30 on: December 09, 2004, 11:26:19 AM »
I hate it when people complain about my ice storm dodging when they just have to make a fod to hit me and make the dodge way too dangerous .
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Offline ViperDE2004

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« Reply #31 on: December 09, 2004, 11:38:51 AM »
Quote
I hate it when people complain about my ice storm dodging when they just have to make a fod to hit me and make the dodge way too dangerous .
[snapback]12385[/snapback]

Ice storm: if you miss the person you have really bad aim. I would recomend practicing your acuracy. Because if you cant hit a mage, you got a serious problem!!!

-Viper
Viper, Leader of {Legions of Sages} -(LoS)-

Offline James_2k

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« Reply #32 on: December 09, 2004, 12:03:41 PM »
Quote
Quote
I hate it when people complain about my ice storm dodging when they just have to make a fod to hit me and make the dodge way too dangerous .
[snapback]12385[/snapback]

Ice storm: if you miss the person you have really bad aim. I would recomend practicing your acuracy. Because if you cant hit a mage, you got a serious problem!!!

-Viper
[snapback]12387[/snapback]
i think that people miss because they queue a couple up and target the ground next to the opponent, when he moves, the 2nd storms misses. a valid tactic in my opinion- go max! :)

Offline ViperDE2004

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What you hate about mages
« Reply #33 on: December 09, 2004, 02:54:15 PM »
Quote
Quote
Quote
I hate it when people complain about my ice storm dodging when they just have to make a fod to hit me and make the dodge way too dangerous .
[snapback]12385[/snapback]

Ice storm: if you miss the person you have really bad aim. I would recomend practicing your acuracy. Because if you cant hit a mage, you got a serious problem!!!

-Viper
[snapback]12387[/snapback]
i think that people miss because they queue a couple up and target the ground next to the opponent, when he moves, the 2nd storms misses. a valid tactic in my opinion- go max! :)
[snapback]12393[/snapback]

A good mage Casts only when the oponent has made his move. Not 5 movesin a row.

-Viper
Viper, Leader of {Legions of Sages} -(LoS)-

Offline Tea-cup

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« Reply #34 on: December 09, 2004, 03:07:38 PM »
I wonder if this is a good formula for sr checks:
castlevel + feats + a lowering spell +1d10 -vs -  the monk's sr

About lowering spells, it are things like mord's and nature's balance that lower sr by 10 or more. It's not ment to stack them btw.

37 + 6 + 10 + 1d10 against a monk whit 57 sr gives 50% change to pierce the sr. I think it's a bit low, maybe changing 1d10 to 1d20, that would make 50% on 62.

Any suggestions?

-Mel

Offline Maxou

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« Reply #35 on: December 09, 2004, 03:33:16 PM »
Quote
I wonder if this is a good formula for sr checks:
castlevel + feats + a lowering spell +1d10 -vs -  the monk's sr

About lowering spells, it are things like mord's and nature's balance that lower sr by 10 or more. It's not ment to stack them btw.

37 + 6 + 10 + 1d10 against a monk whit 57 sr gives 50% change to pierce the sr. I think it's a bit low, maybe changing 1d10 to 1d20, that would make 50% on 62.

Any suggestions?

-Mel
[snapback]12418[/snapback]

Mel u're starting with wich lvl of mage ? 1d20 would be cool but that would kill the sr build vs mage I think . Dunno really .

James n' Viper >> that wasn't that . It was total anticipation anyway he was just attacking with ice storm . I just saw like few isaacs and  only  2 fod .
« Last Edit: December 09, 2004, 03:33:44 PM by Maxou »
Lord of Doriath .
Part of CoD .
Member of LoS .

Maxou :
- Sexy Sorcerer :  Mage dueler only
- Mighty Pingu : High dmg monk
- Wild Lion : Melee Bard str
- Wise Panda : eb AA
- Evil Rabbit : All round sorc

Offline James_2k

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« Reply #36 on: December 09, 2004, 04:02:14 PM »
Quote
Quote
Quote
Quote
I hate it when people complain about my ice storm dodging when they just have to make a fod to hit me and make the dodge way too dangerous .
[snapback]12385[/snapback]

Ice storm: if you miss the person you have really bad aim. I would recomend practicing your acuracy. Because if you cant hit a mage, you got a serious problem!!!

-Viper
[snapback]12387[/snapback]
i think that people miss because they queue a couple up and target the ground next to the opponent, when he moves, the 2nd storms misses. a valid tactic in my opinion- go max! :)
[snapback]12393[/snapback]

A good mage Casts only when the oponent has made his move. Not 5 movesin a row.

-Viper
[snapback]12412[/snapback]
hmm, i didnt say this made you a good mage, nor do i stack spells, the point i was making was that people do use this tactic so, max, for example is free to avoid it by running.

this is how people miss with spells, then blame the opponent for it, i dont say that they're skilled however. but they shouldnt blame the players who exploit their shortcoming/s - which was my point from the start
« Last Edit: December 09, 2004, 06:32:33 PM by James_2k »

Offline Tea-cup

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« Reply #37 on: December 09, 2004, 04:06:05 PM »
Quote
Quote
I wonder if this is a good formula for sr checks:
castlevel + feats + a lowering spell +1d10 -vs -  the monk's sr

About lowering spells, it are things like mord's and nature's balance that lower sr by 10 or more. It's not ment to stack them btw.

37 + 6 + 10 + 1d10 against a monk whit 57 sr gives 50% change to pierce the sr. I think it's a bit low, maybe changing 1d10 to 1d20, that would make 50% on 62.

Any suggestions?

-Mel
[snapback]12418[/snapback]

Mel u're starting with wich lvl of mage ? 1d20 would be cool but that would kill the sr build vs mage I think . Dunno really .

James n' Viper >> that wasn't that . It was total anticipation anyway he was just attacking with ice storm . I just saw like few isaacs and  only  2 fod .
[snapback]12425[/snapback]
Well you can get 70 sr whit a monk. Maxed mage does go to 65 pierce now. Whit a maxroll. But the not pure casters / sr monks should be balanced. Not really those sr tanks or pierce mages. They have other weaknesses enough.

-Mel

Offline James_2k

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« Reply #38 on: December 09, 2004, 06:37:26 PM »
Quote
Quote
Quote
I wonder if this is a good formula for sr checks:
castlevel + feats + a lowering spell +1d10 -vs -  the monk's sr

About lowering spells, it are things like mord's and nature's balance that lower sr by 10 or more. It's not ment to stack them btw.

37 + 6 + 10 + 1d10 against a monk whit 57 sr gives 50% change to pierce the sr. I think it's a bit low, maybe changing 1d10 to 1d20, that would make 50% on 62.

Any suggestions?

-Mel
[snapback]12418[/snapback]

Mel u're starting with wich lvl of mage ? 1d20 would be cool but that would kill the sr build vs mage I think . Dunno really .

James n' Viper >> that wasn't that . It was total anticipation anyway he was just attacking with ice storm . I just saw like few isaacs and  only  2 fod .
[snapback]12425[/snapback]
Well you can get 70 sr whit a monk. Maxed mage does go to 65 pierce now. Whit a maxroll. But the not pure casters / sr monks should be balanced. Not really those sr tanks or pierce mages. They have other weaknesses enough.

-Mel
[snapback]12435[/snapback]
ok ok - firstly mel - please put the 'h' at the end of the word 'with' whit means something completely different :P

and i like the new system, there arent many pure mages left anymore, and pure SR monks can be wasted using a bit of the old -> Hellball -> TS -> Attack -> Hide -> Attack -> TS (repeat from Hide until one of you is dead) :D

Offline Knuckles

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What you hate about mages
« Reply #39 on: December 09, 2004, 06:49:46 PM »
why would you use TS if your a mage that can hide (rolf) :P
O'hana means Family, Family means no get left behind or Frogotten:)

Tails+Cosmo Forever too ^_^

"If I should visit the moon, well, i'll dance on a moonbeam, and then, I will make a wish on a star and i'll wish I was home once again. Though i'd like to look down at the Earth from above, I would miss all the places and people I love. So although I may go, i'll be cominghome soon. 'Cause I don't want to live on the moon."

626+624 forever ^^

Offline James_2k

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« Reply #40 on: December 09, 2004, 06:59:28 PM »
Quote
why would you use TS if your a mage that can hide (rolf) :P
[snapback]12471[/snapback]
hmm, are you for real? i have a 38AB i can harldy hit a flat footed level 1 char with that: and so i say to you:::


:P

p.s.

with TS, well, mwhahahaha etc..

Offline Knuckles

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« Reply #41 on: December 09, 2004, 07:04:00 PM »
O.o why would you use melee for a wizard anyway.

wizards are ment to be weak.
O'hana means Family, Family means no get left behind or Frogotten:)

Tails+Cosmo Forever too ^_^

"If I should visit the moon, well, i'll dance on a moonbeam, and then, I will make a wish on a star and i'll wish I was home once again. Though i'd like to look down at the Earth from above, I would miss all the places and people I love. So although I may go, i'll be cominghome soon. 'Cause I don't want to live on the moon."

626+624 forever ^^

Offline James_2k

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« Reply #42 on: December 09, 2004, 07:06:51 PM »
Quote
O.o why would you use melee for a wizard anyway.

wizards are ment to be weak.
[snapback]12474[/snapback]
lol

come duel me with your non mage :P

Offline Knuckles

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« Reply #43 on: December 09, 2004, 07:11:21 PM »
I KNOW MORE ABOUT WIZARDS THEN ANYONE ELSE DOSE :angry2:  :angry2:  :angry:  :excl:  :excl:  :excl:

SO DON'T GIVE ME ANY BS
O'hana means Family, Family means no get left behind or Frogotten:)

Tails+Cosmo Forever too ^_^

"If I should visit the moon, well, i'll dance on a moonbeam, and then, I will make a wish on a star and i'll wish I was home once again. Though i'd like to look down at the Earth from above, I would miss all the places and people I love. So although I may go, i'll be cominghome soon. 'Cause I don't want to live on the moon."

626+624 forever ^^

Offline James_2k

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« Reply #44 on: December 09, 2004, 07:16:00 PM »
Quote
I KNOW MORE ABOUT WIZARDS THEN ANYONE ELSE DOSE :angry2:  :angry2:  :angry:  :excl:  :excl:  :excl:

SO DON'T GIVE ME ANY BS
[snapback]12476[/snapback]
lol

control yourself

and you obviously know nothing about sorc rdd sds then :P

Offline Knuckles

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What you hate about mages
« Reply #45 on: December 09, 2004, 07:21:45 PM »
I dislike them
O'hana means Family, Family means no get left behind or Frogotten:)

Tails+Cosmo Forever too ^_^

"If I should visit the moon, well, i'll dance on a moonbeam, and then, I will make a wish on a star and i'll wish I was home once again. Though i'd like to look down at the Earth from above, I would miss all the places and people I love. So although I may go, i'll be cominghome soon. 'Cause I don't want to live on the moon."

626+624 forever ^^

Offline James_2k

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« Reply #46 on: December 09, 2004, 07:23:51 PM »
Quote
I dislike them
[snapback]12478[/snapback]
fine with me,

so, next topic of conversation? :)

Offline Knuckles

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« Reply #47 on: December 09, 2004, 07:25:51 PM »
lol
O'hana means Family, Family means no get left behind or Frogotten:)

Tails+Cosmo Forever too ^_^

"If I should visit the moon, well, i'll dance on a moonbeam, and then, I will make a wish on a star and i'll wish I was home once again. Though i'd like to look down at the Earth from above, I would miss all the places and people I love. So although I may go, i'll be cominghome soon. 'Cause I don't want to live on the moon."

626+624 forever ^^

Offline ViperDE2004

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« Reply #48 on: December 10, 2004, 12:58:51 PM »
Ok..... But whats the point of having a monk with 70 sr? the only thing you can duel with those type of chars is mages.  It suks vs anyother class as of what ive seen.

-Viper
Viper, Leader of {Legions of Sages} -(LoS)-

Offline Maxou

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« Reply #49 on: December 10, 2004, 01:06:53 PM »
Quote
Ok..... But whats the point of having a monk with 70 sr? the only thing you can duel with those type of chars is mages.  It suks vs anyother class as of what ive seen.

-Viper
[snapback]12567[/snapback]

HAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHhAHAH !!!!!!

I GET U VIPER I GET U !!!!!

And what's the poing of havig 38 sorc ?? The only thing u can duel with those type of chars is mages . It suck vs anyother class as of what I've seen .


MUHAHAHHAHA .

U'll tell me >> It's for mage duel because mage duel is fun !!
But perhaps for builder who have 70 sr monk it's fun to pwn mage .
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Maxou :
- Sexy Sorcerer :  Mage dueler only
- Mighty Pingu : High dmg monk
- Wild Lion : Melee Bard str
- Wise Panda : eb AA
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Offline Tea-cup

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« Reply #50 on: December 10, 2004, 01:26:49 PM »
Quote
ok ok - firstly mel - please put the 'h' at the end of the word 'with' whit means something completely different :P

and i like the new system, there arent many pure mages left anymore, and pure SR monks can be wasted using a bit of the old -> Hellball -> TS -> Attack -> Hide -> Attack -> TS (repeat from Hide until one of you is dead) :D
[snapback]12467[/snapback]
You won't even touch a good monk whit a mage. You don't duel my sr monk for example, you can't even hope for getting it injured. That hide/ts trik doesn't works on a good monk .... Whit a few more mage levels and mords you can hit my sr monk on arivs now. But I know, you have to offer a few other things for it. But that's what balanced pvp is about, no perfect uber builds.

Notes: a 38 mage can be alround.
70 sr is a bit useless, 64 is already overkill for 99% of the mages (counting the -10 whit mords in it).
And ts/hide whit a mage can't hit a good monk. Even whit 25 base attack.

-Mel

Offline Mo

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« Reply #51 on: December 10, 2004, 02:22:16 PM »
I was the one complaining with Maxou dodging Ice Storm.

I am sorry for complaining because I was under the assumption that Maxou was using a real mage and I was in a mage duel with him.  

In mages duels YOU DO NOT RUN AROUND.  

Maxous Sorc build has no real chance of defeating a proper wizard in a magic duel so he has no choice but to run away from ice storm which does 108 dmg to his character.

All these new "battle" mages i am seeing these days are old and stupid builds.  It has LONG  been know that Sorc's can defeat any other melee or range build.  This is why I do not duel with my PM anymore..it's just not fair.  There is no real skill behind these multi-classes.  Myself and my fellow AoM members have chosen to build mages that solely duel with magic.  For this reason there is no real need to waste AC on items or to use tower shields and all that.

In closing I would like to re-itertate that caster dueling is about spells and timing..not about running away from dmg...if you messed your timing up then take the pain.

If someone wishes to disagree with me then go ahead but understand that you don't know what you're talking about.

PS. Max why not get some ice resist??  
I'll answer...cause you just like to waste time dueling melee and don't understand the first thing about magic.

Sorry it just pisses me off that there are no real caster on GS anymore.
« Last Edit: December 10, 2004, 02:24:44 PM by Mo »

Offline Maxou

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« Reply #52 on: December 10, 2004, 03:15:52 PM »
Quote
I was the one complaining with Maxou dodging Ice Storm.

I am sorry for complaining because I was under the assumption that Maxou was using a real mage and I was in a mage duel with him. 

In mages duels YOU DO NOT RUN AROUND. 

Maxous Sorc build has no real chance of defeating a proper wizard in a magic duel so he has no choice but to run away from ice storm which does 108 dmg to his character.

All these new "battle" mages i am seeing these days are old and stupid builds.  It has LONG  been know that Sorc's can defeat any other melee or range build.  This is why I do not duel with my PM anymore..it's just not fair.  There is no real skill behind these multi-classes.  Myself and my fellow AoM members have chosen to build mages that solely duel with magic.  For this reason there is no real need to waste AC on items or to use tower shields and all that.

In closing I would like to re-itertate that caster dueling is about spells and timing..not about running away from dmg...if you messed your timing up then take the pain.

If someone wishes to disagree with me then go ahead but understand that you don't know what you're talking about.

PS. Max why not get some ice resist?? 
I'll answer...cause you just like to waste time dueling melee and don't understand the first thing about magic.

Sorry it just pisses me off that there are no real caster on GS anymore.
[snapback]12574[/snapback]

Just too bad .

Your ... "definition" of a ... "real mage" could not be mine Mo .
Just accept that other people can have other ideas .
You're not even letting a luck of answering to your post . I don't know what I am talking about . Right . Sry . Man .

Don't worry I'll build a dumb nearly pure mage . To fight ... those ... " proper wizard " with a ... "proper wizard" .

About that timing thing I have something to say though ( even if I don't know what I am talking about ) ... never thought it was an AoM who teached me that ?  never thought of what timing it need to dodge ice storm ? never thought u could have used fod to prevent my dodge ?
Let me answer for you ( you answered for me isn't it ? ) > You thought of that but who cares ? MY ICE STORM DOES 108 DMG ON HIM !! Let's use only ice storm yeehaaa !!

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Maxou :
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- Mighty Pingu : High dmg monk
- Wild Lion : Melee Bard str
- Wise Panda : eb AA
- Evil Rabbit : All round sorc

Offline Tea-cup

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« Reply #53 on: December 10, 2004, 03:20:29 PM »
Quote
Sorry it just pisses me off that there are no real caster on GS anymore.
[snapback]12574[/snapback]
It's something I miss on gs, it's a other way of dueling than the duels whit triks (hide/wof/taunt) or 20 roll duels whit monks. (and I know I'm not good at mage duels :P)

I want to try this on arivs, just to test some idea's:
- lower ac for any sorc or bard or wizard build ( -5 or so )
- working breaches/nature's balance for lowering sr (already running)
- improving dispels DC for higher levels (already running)

You may think clerics builds get to strong then, but I say not because the dispels are imporved. You can rip off a heavy load of buffs whit a single dispel if you're a high level caster. The weak point in cleric builds are their buffs.

This is also good for builds that don't depends on ts or a heavy load of buffs, like some ranger/fighter builds. And about hiders, they always have a weak point in their build, horn, wof, knockdown, 100+ damage icestorm, deva crit, options enough.

I would love to see some poeple their opinion about this. I not really know if -5 ac is a good idea for example.

Side note: I did kill your pm a few times whit a melee kind char mo, some kind of weapmaster, your pm is fair against some builds. But most melee builds will not have a change for 1 single win. And maxou, the old mage duels have something special. You can find anything dull or stupid, starting whit the idea to play a game.

-Mel
« Last Edit: December 10, 2004, 03:21:45 PM by Tea-cup »

Offline James_2k

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« Reply #54 on: December 10, 2004, 03:23:28 PM »
Quote
Quote
ok ok - firstly mel - please put the 'h' at the end of the word 'with' whit means something completely different :P

and i like the new system, there arent many pure mages left anymore, and pure SR monks can be wasted using a bit of the old -> Hellball -> TS -> Attack -> Hide -> Attack -> TS (repeat from Hide until one of you is dead) :D
[snapback]12467[/snapback]
You won't even touch a good monk whit a mage. You don't duel my sr monk for example, you can't even hope for getting it injured. That hide/ts trik doesn't works on a good monk .... Whit a few more mage levels and mords you can hit my sr monk on arivs now. But I know, you have to offer a few other things for it. But that's what balanced pvp is about, no perfect uber builds.

Notes: a 38 mage can be alround.
70 sr is a bit useless, 64 is already overkill for 99% of the mages (counting the -10 whit mords in it).
And ts/hide whit a mage can't hit a good monk. Even whit 25 base attack.

-Mel
[snapback]12569[/snapback]
to be fair, you seem to be the exception, when ever i have dueled you hider monk i have managed to het it to injured im sure.

anyway it matters not, it works vs a lot of classes

Offline Tea-cup

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« Reply #55 on: December 10, 2004, 03:44:19 PM »
Quote
to be fair, you seem to be the exception, when ever i have dueled you hider monk i have managed to het it to injured im sure.

anyway it matters not, it works vs a lot of classes
[snapback]12578[/snapback]
I ended barley injured whitout empty body too, but well ... The funny part is, my build is a old very much used build. How I'm the 'exception' then?

-Mel

Offline Maxou

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« Reply #56 on: December 10, 2004, 03:45:38 PM »
I was banned because I answered to Mo's post ... Yeeehhaaa ...
I'll show u respect when u'll show me respect . Thanks ...
That topic will go to flame wars if that continues ... I did not think people could piss me off like THAT on a game ...
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Maxou :
- Sexy Sorcerer :  Mage dueler only
- Mighty Pingu : High dmg monk
- Wild Lion : Melee Bard str
- Wise Panda : eb AA
- Evil Rabbit : All round sorc

Offline Mo

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What you hate about mages
« Reply #57 on: December 10, 2004, 03:46:15 PM »
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I was the one complaining with Maxou dodging Ice Storm.

I am sorry for complaining because I was under the assumption that Maxou was using a real mage and I was in a mage duel with him. 

In mages duels YOU DO NOT RUN AROUND. 

Maxous Sorc build has no real chance of defeating a proper wizard in a magic duel so he has no choice but to run away from ice storm which does 108 dmg to his character.

All these new "battle" mages i am seeing these days are old and stupid builds.  It has LONG  been know that Sorc's can defeat any other melee or range build.  This is why I do not duel with my PM anymore..it's just not fair.  There is no real skill behind these multi-classes.  Myself and my fellow AoM members have chosen to build mages that solely duel with magic.  For this reason there is no real need to waste AC on items or to use tower shields and all that.

In closing I would like to re-itertate that caster dueling is about spells and timing..not about running away from dmg...if you messed your timing up then take the pain.

If someone wishes to disagree with me then go ahead but understand that you don't know what you're talking about.

PS. Max why not get some ice resist?? 
I'll answer...cause you just like to waste time dueling melee and don't understand the first thing about magic.

Sorry it just pisses me off that there are no real caster on GS anymore.
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Just too bad .

Your ... "definition" of a ... "real mage" could not be mine Mo .
Just accept that other people can have other ideas .
You're not even letting a luck of answering to your post . I don't know what I am talking about . Right . Sry . Man .

Don't worry I'll build a dumb nearly pure mage . To fight ... those ... " proper wizard " with a ... "proper wizard" .

About that timing thing I have something to say though ( even if I don't know what I am talking about ) ... never thought it was an AoM who teached me that ?  never thought of what timing it need to dodge ice storm ? never thought u could have used fod to prevent my dodge ?
Let me answer for you ( you answered for me isn't it ? ) > You thought of that but who cares ? MY ICE STORM DOES 108 DMG ON HIM !! Let's use only ice storm yeehaaa !!
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It takes no timing to dodge an area of effect spell.
you know when i am going to cast it and run away.

Why would I use FoD when ice storm does 108 dmg to you because you're too lazy to add ice resist like anyone would.

I am through with you.  Your disrespect troubles me.
I've earned my respect..you've earned nothing
« Last Edit: December 10, 2004, 03:48:59 PM by Mo »

Offline James_2k

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What you hate about mages
« Reply #58 on: December 10, 2004, 03:46:42 PM »
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to be fair, you seem to be the exception, when ever i have dueled you hider monk i have managed to het it to injured im sure.

anyway it matters not, it works vs a lot of classes
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I ended barley injured whitout empty body too, but well ... The funny part is, my build is a old very much used build. How I'm the 'exception' then?

-Mel
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your the exception in that you survived

and whatever, im not saying my build is good vs anything - you are a lot more experienced than me - you should win :P

anyway this conversation is pointless, peace :)

Offline Maxou

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What you hate about mages
« Reply #59 on: December 11, 2004, 02:09:16 AM »
This is pointless .

Mo > Perhaps I overeacted but I wasn't the one who started with offensive words .  Let's ignore each other in a mutual scorn .
« Last Edit: December 11, 2004, 02:10:45 AM by Maxou »
Lord of Doriath .
Part of CoD .
Member of LoS .

Maxou :
- Sexy Sorcerer :  Mage dueler only
- Mighty Pingu : High dmg monk
- Wild Lion : Melee Bard str
- Wise Panda : eb AA
- Evil Rabbit : All round sorc