Blade Barrier and Improved Evasion on item

[gashmo]

Im not sur eit matters so much for GS because GS doesnt allow feat properties on items anyway.
However, if u use Imp Ev on an item and run thru a clerics blade abarrier u will be hurt even if u make the save.
This means Imp Ev isnt working I guess.

Monks escape with no damage though I think.

Anyone have any thought son this?

[Tea-cup]

It's true that bladebarier is a reflex trow and that evasion should work on it. But it doesn't unbalance the pvp in gs. If it did it would be changed.

-Mel

[420]

Actually, I never discussed the Blade Barrier bug with Talon because I was waiting to see if 1.64 fixed it.

Before HotU, Improved Evasion worked correctly with Blade Barrier, if you made your reflex save you took no damage. Now it's broke, I first noticed it when Raelias said he wouldn't duel me anymore because I used Blade Barrier.

Monks have some protection with their +1 damage reduction but they do take damage too.

Anyway, I'll talk about this with Talon because Improved Evasion is not allowed on items and it is somewhat difficult to get normally and the way it is now (bugged) there is no difference between evasion and improved evasion.

I also want to deal with the issue of Gust of Wind blowing away Blade Barrier, that is just stupid.

-420

[Hydros]

Actually, I never discussed the Blade Barrier bug with Talon because I was waiting to see if 1.64 fixed it.

I also want to deal with the issue of Gust of Wind blowing away Blade Barrier, that is just stupid.

-420

[snapback]8880[/snapback]

Gust of wind are supposed to blow away Blade Barrier :S . "Any area effects such as cloudkill". Just implying.

[420]

Gust of wind are supposed to blow away Blade Barrier :S . "Any area effects such as cloudkill". Just implying.

[snapback]8897[/snapback]

Actually "Gust of Wind" is suppose to blow away cloud-like or weather area effects only, I believe. Can someone post the official 3E D&D rules on this spell, the only thing I found on the official web site was this:

"Gust of Wind. Blows away or knocks down smaller creatures."

It just seems strange that a level 3 spell like "Gust of Wind" could dispel ANY AOE spell ,automatically, while a Greater Dispel or Mords Dysjunction only has a slight chance to dispel even a low level area effect spell (since 1.64).

-420

[c r a n e_osl]

Gust Of Wind
Evocation [Air]
Level Drd 2, Sor/Wiz 2
Casting Time 1 Standard Action
Range 60 ft
Duration 1 round
Saving Throws Fortitude Negates
Spell Resistence Yes
_________

This spell creates a severe blast of air (approximately 50mph) that originates from you, affecting all creatures in its path.

 A tiny creature or smaller creature on the ground is knocked down and rolled 1d4x10 feet, taking 1d4 points of nonlethal damage per 10 feet.....Medium creatures are unable to move forward against the force of wind....Large or larger creatures may move normally within a gust of wind effect. Any creature, regardless of size, takes a -4 penalty on ranged attacks and Listen checks in the area of the gust...Gust of wind can be made permanent with a permanency spell.
_________


/C r a n e.

[BzK]

Think about it this way, wouldn't changing Gust of Wind promote Blade Barrier spam?  :closedeyes:

[420]

This spell creates a severe blast of air (approximately 50mph) that originates from you, affecting all creatures in its path.

 A tiny creature or smaller creature on the ground is knocked down and rolled 1d4x10 feet, taking 1d4 points of nonlethal damage per 10 feet.....Medium creatures are unable to move forward against the force of wind....Large or larger creatures may move normally within a gust of wind effect. Any creature, regardless of size, takes a -4 penalty on ranged attacks and Listen checks in the area of the gust...Gust of wind can be made permanent with a permanency spell.
 

[snapback]8990[/snapback]

OK, so it says nothing about blowing away AOEs, it's suppose to be centered on the caster instead of targeted AND it is suppose to apply penalties to ranged attacks and listen.

I see it's just another Bioware fuck up.

It just seems odd that a gust of wind could blow away a wall of swords. I doubt people would/could spam WoS any more than the already do.

-420

[Illutian]

ppl i think may have complained that BB could be resisted by monks(using SR)..i tested in 1.62 and i was able to stand in a 10 BB without taking damage on my 100 SR monk(modded SR with dm command) so it may have been a balancing thing, but then BB would be too powerful so Bio, being the neutralist they are, now have to FUBAR everything else to re-balance spells and damages....etc


*meh, there's my 2 cents worth*

[Tea-cup]

It not only blows away bladebariers, frogs, ect   but also silence, battle tide. This allows tactics like getting rid of silence whit a single silenced gust of wind. It may be completly messed up bioware. At the moment I think this spell is ok. Blowing away other players, doing damage and changing it to level 2 are a bit ... hard and weird to do. Making it so that it gets casted at the casters location looks fine to me.

--to stay ontopic--

Bladebariers. That spell only gets bad if it's spammed. Changing it may cause more spams of it and takes away one of the only good offensif cleric spells. I completly agree the spell can be used in a lame way, but it's far from the only spell where this is true for. Changing improved evasion to work on it would also change evasion. This is easy to get, all monks and almost all hiders on gs have it.

How I would change it:
Lowering the blades duration (2rounds or lower, makes max 4 bariers) and damage/lvl (1d6 each 2 castlevels). So that it only makes 50-60 damage if the caster is level 35 or more. Then only high level clerics actualy have any use to cast it (a bit like FoD, maxed blades ask lvl 9 to cast) lvl20+ monks would only get real damage from higher level clerics. It helps against spams too.
Spamming blades on level 20 is way too strong now, the lower damage would fix that.

Reply as much as posible

-Mel

[gashmo]

Thanks for replying guys!!

Yeah bb is a bit strong now at L20 given that impr ev is broken (glad to know that 420 noticed it).

Whats the highest DC u can get on bb?


--- other commentary by me  ----

Gust of wind provides some balance, if u have the xp and ur char has the spell. Spell mantle also works.

I am quite surprised more clerics on gs dont spam bb. In my duelling, Ive only been spammed with bb about um 3-4 duels out of say 20-30 with clerics. By spamming I mean more than 6 blade barriers. In the 3-4 i was spammed about 12 bbs or more and i was running all over the arena saying "excuse me!!" "sorry!!" "bb mad cleric!!".. etc etc. But of course all the other clerics cast at least 3 bbs.

Just recently (before gs seemed to vanish) i encoutnered heaps more clerics. They havent "spammed" bb yet but i guess they will soon.

[Blood Angel]

it's simple, bb is bugged and if the cleric uses it too often on you then just hate him the �?�½ reflex save is ignored and that can be a real bitch

now gust of wind, I love that spell, only thing that saved me from clerics in sou when they silenced and I do believe it also blows away bb, so that spell is just really great

[Raelias]

Whoa whoa 420 noticed it? LoL I was the one yelling at him for it. I was a hothead that day and after like the 3rd cleric duel where there was spamming BB, I saw 420's and I just flipped. I was in a bad mood that day and was tired of all the bugs and unbalanced issues in NWN. Oh well. But the BB thing... I think Mel's idea is possibly the best. She brings up good key issues about why you should change it. But saying that all monks and hiders have it is not true. Some people get the hider levels/monk levels enough to get imp evasion alone, and some other bonus effects of course, and when a spell like BB can tear right through it, it can be PRETTY annoying. I think you should bring your idea up to Talon Mel.

[Zaron]

could be nice with not so high dmg on bb....like i saw this lvl 20 cleric 2 days ago or so...he was like spamming it untill his opponent died..like 10 or something...crazy....well it was a lame way to win i think.

[Raelias]

Oh ya dude and when they do that it gets to the point where you can't even attack them without hitting a BB or 2. Kristie use to be like that for awhile. So lame. And when you can't even protect vs it or anything makes it nerve you even more. Specially if you have a char where it should be protected but because of some stupid bug. I had like 4 duels like that on the day I exploded on 420 LoL. Ya on 40's you can get tons of spellslots so those BB's can reach like 30's...

Though I say again I think Mel has the best idea but maybe with some tweaking.